Ranking the Paizo Adventure Paths (англ. комментарии)

Имеет прямое отношение к подкасту капитанов ПФС №2. Это сделанная мной для личного пользования сборка англ. комментариев о различных Pathfinder Adventure Path.
Возможно будет удалено.

http://rollforinitiative.blogspot.ru/2013/11/ranking-paizo-adventure-paths-some.html
Ranking the Paizo Adventure Paths (some spoilers)
Today I'm going to rank the Paizo Adventure Paths (APs). I am including the 3.5 APs but excluding the Dungeon ones (Shackled City, Age of Worms, and Savage Tide). The main criteria is fun to play taking into consideration amount of role playing, interesting combat encounters, cool themes, and great story.

The APs in order or appearance are: Rise of the Runelords, Curse of the Crimson Throne, Second Darkness, Legacy of Fire, Council of Thieves, Kingmaker, Serpent's Skull, Carrion Crown, Jade Regent, Skull and Shackles, Shattered Star, and Reign of Winter. I will admit to being slightly biased towards the earlier ones since I've read them over more and played most of them.

Tier 1 — Over all Great with just a few weak spots
1. Curse of the Crimson Throne. I love the first three parts of this one but part 2 is really the star here. With a group that loves to role play this AP would be amazing. Lots of interesting NPCs, great stories, and some interesting encounters make this one the winner. Part 4 is a bit railroady but still has some great themes and interesting encounters. Part 5 is a massive, very difficult dungeon. Should be very fun. The last part is a bit weaker like most of the final chapters but does a good job of wrapping up the story that really took play in the first three parts. Parts 4 and 5 are really good but don't have the same feel as the other four parts.
+ I agree that Curse of the Crimson Throne is the best of the bunch, so far. Amazing campaign, with part two being a real strong point.
+ Possible my favorite, it's overall just really neat and has a strong story and city focus to it. It has a meandering 'mystic native american expy spirit journey' part near the end that could be removed easily for the better though. The big dungeon crawl in this one is actually really cool, if a bit convoluted.
+ Both as a player and a GM, I enjoyed the continued fleshing-out of Varisia, the story of the Vancaskerkin family, and the story of Korvosa itself. That said, there were a few things that stretched my disbelief as this adventure path went on. Most notably is the [spoiler] almost overnight appearance of the Grey Maidens as a credible military force within the city, displacing the established city watch and military orders almost completely. The players are also encouraged to tie themselves strongly to Korvosa, but spend almost a third of the adventure path away from it. My understanding is that this was somewhat addressed in Council of Thieves, which is complete city-based.[/spoiler] I also think that a fair amount of the Crimson Throne is _very_ linear (talk to group A to get an item for group B who will give you access to group C, who have the information you need), but Paizo does try to address this in side bars for groups that want to stray from the path, and experience the adventure in other ways.
+ Crimson Throne had great villains and NPCs; you got to spend a lot of time in the city of Korvosa which rewarded investment in the setting; it did have its overly linear bit in the middle but the adventure came out and said «Hey GM, this is linear as written, you'll need to mix this up a bit.» I don't need a printed adventure to give me more sandbox, I can toss random encounters with the best of them.

2. Kingmaker. A close second. This AP can really be anything you want it to be. It is so modular that it can be expanded with little difficulty incorporating whatever you want. It has an old school feel with the first few parts heavily focused on exploration (hex crawling). The last part was very cool since since it is really just a series of gonzo boss fights tough enough to challenge any party. The only real fault of this one is that the BBEG at the end doesn't really feel connected to the rest of the Path.
+ Kingmaker is still tops in my book.
+ The hexcrawling and adventuring is actually pretty great. The kingdom building is tedious and poorly designed, and the mass combat is worse. At some point, you find out that an army of 100 trolls is marching on your kingdom. But you're level 12, they're ground-bound melee suckers out in the open with no caster support, so why would you send your tiny men out to fight and die, when you can just have an afternoon's entertainment? Also, book 6 feels randomly stapled on.
+ There are hints of Book 6 in the other books but they are few and far between. A DM needs to recognize that and just foreshadow book 6 more.
+ Kingmaker I like a lot, although I gravitate towards things that emulate high-level AD&D play, so the kingdom building drew me in. Unless it's heavily foreshadowed, the last adventure comes from somewhere out in right field, though, and the mass combat system is lacking. That's easy enough to replace with a third-party mass combat system of choice, so it's not a major detriment.
+ My players are just now getting the kingdom-building stages, but love the sandbox style of adventuring. As a DM, I also enjoy the option for lengthy time-lapses between adventuring sessions, as the meteoric rise to power of the PCs in any adventure path does strain credibility a bit for me.
+ So far, I like it because to me it feels like RotRL by including many types of genres, but it does it by giving the players the ability to control when the events will happen. My biggest problem is not the AP itself, but the hype people place on it. Is it a sandbox, sorta as you still have to accomplish the tasks provided to achieve the final X to unlock the next book or end of campaign.

3. Rise of the Runelords (Anniversary Edition). This one is great because they got to go back and fix the minor flaws from the first time around. This one has some great roleplay elements, fun combats and great back story that is slowly unveiled over the first few parts. In the last third, things start to go down hill. The dungeon in part 5 is both rather pointless and is so long. Part 6 isn't too bad but we usually have ADD by this point in the campaign and the way its written is very long and drawn out. We played a shorted version of it.
+ Rise of the Runelord is really great old school. However, too many town people to keep straight though. You keep meeting people who after a single session you never see again.
+ Probably the most memorable overall, with some really well done imagery and pacing. But it does still have a filler dungeon in the middle that is incredible long and the story doesn't really start in earnest until the third adventure.
+ This is honestly a very close race along with Kingmaker. RotRL edges the others out for me because it was an excellent introduction to the adventure paths and Golarion in general, and Varisia specifically. The party gets many memorable encounters, and a truely epic villain. The gold standard for the Paizo adventure paths.
+ it just has pretty much every main genre thrown in. Want mystery, check; Want horror, check; Want fantasy, check; Dungeon crawl, check; Hack'n'Slash, check. Yes, you may have to slug thru some parts you may not like, but it is not your typical long wait nor is it totally boring.

Tier 2 — Good but need some help to be great.
4. Reign of Winter. This AP wasn't really what I was expecting and it won me over as I read through it. This is one of the rare APs that seemed to get stronger as it went along instead of the other way around. Part 5 is down right weird and yet is rather appealing. Who hasn't wondered how high level PCs would do against WW1 troops and tanks?

5. Shattered Star. If you really love dungeons I'm sure you would rate this one higher. Sure the dungeons have very different themes, contain some interesting role playing options but over all it just didn't appeal to me. There is usually at least one part in each AP that is «WOW» and this one really didn't have one. It was just consistently good.
+ It's definitely a interesting one. Most of the adventures are calls backs to early APs, often tying up plot loose ends. But the story isn't tight at all, there is relatively little reason to actually recover the Shattered Star(especially since someone will likely at some point correctly ask 'Isn't putting back together a artifact ancient megalomaniac archmages thought was too dangerous a bad idea?). And while the finale has some good ideas, it's kind of a mess.

6. Carrion Crown. This one grew on me the more times I read it. The horror themes were fun and I thought the first two parts were quite unique and entertaining (and difficult). Part three was a bit like «Clue» before ending as a zombie movie. I cut this campaign off here because I didn't really care for the second half. Part 4 tries very hard to be Lovecraftian. Plot wise Part 5 makes no sense, and although Part 6 had one super awesome encounter (OK maybe 2) most of the book was rather blah and the BBEG was a pushover.
+ Carrion Crown is nice gothic horror campaign
+ Part 1 is very good and the first half of part 2 is amazing. Part 3 is stupid, part 4 sets up a great atmosphere and ruins it with super-dull fights, part 5 is silly and very poorly statted, and part 6 is a bunch of casters in 10'*10' rooms with super complicated stat blocks and the staying power of wet tissue paper.
+ I'm very mixed on this one. On the one hand, it's interesting gothic/horror adventures. On the other hand, the adventures are mostly pretty poorly put together. The first one is pretty much all All Haunts, All The Time which is really awkward and like most of the dungeons in the APs, the prison is too big to pace itself well with the overall feel of the 'small haunted town' story it's trying to do. The second one is just kind of a mess. The third is even messier and pretty stupid to boot. The fourth is pretty cool, but does have the issue of being both a detour thematically(it drops gothic horror for sci-fi horror) and being a big potential TPK fest if your saves aren't up to snuff. The fifth is cool, though it seems misplaced since doing lackey work for a bunch of bumbling vampire nobles using you as a chance to slap fight eachother seems much more low level than high level grunt work. The sixth is /awful/. Downright the worst of any of the AP adventures.
+ I'm very mixed on this one. On the one hand, it's interesting gothic/horror adventures. On the other hand, the adventures are mostly pretty poorly put together. The first one is pretty much all All Haunts, All The Time which is really awkward and like most of the dungeons in the APs, the prison is too big to pace itself well with the overall feel of the 'small haunted town' story it's trying to do. The second one is just kind of a mess. The third is even messier and pretty stupid to boot. The fourth is pretty cool, but does have the issue of being both a detour thematically(it drops gothic horror for sci-fi horror) and being a big potential TPK fest if your saves aren't up to snuff. The fifth is cool, though it seems misplaced since doing lackey work for a bunch of bumbling vampire nobles using you as a chance to slap fight eachother seems much more low level than high level grunt work. The sixth is /awful/. Downright the worst of any of the AP adventures.

7. Legacy of Fire. Pugwumpies. That word still sends shivers down my spine. May I never encounter them again. This one had a great theme, lots of fun in the first two parts but kind of lost its way in the middle. Part three was a blatant railroad and then both Parts 4 and 5 involve being trapped in either a pocket dimension or another plane of existence. A bit repetitive and by the time we finished part 5 we were still walking around in same gear we had in part 3.
+ Part of this is a personal fondness for genies and desert adventuring. My group is only just starting adventure 3, but I've really enjoyed how fleshed out the background is. I can't speak for this one from a DM perspective, but I really like all of the flavour. My GM had toyed with adapting some of the Kingmaker kingdom rules for Kelmerene, but ultimately decided against it. Once again, points from me for allowing lengthy breaks between the adventures.

8. Skull and Shackles. I really wanted to love this one but after Part 1 I found it just fell flat. A DM who loved the material and really put some life into this AP could probably make it great but it definitely needs some love as most of it just seemed rather blah and generic.
+ Skull & Shackles was fantastic. Books 5 & 6 are a little shaky, but overall it is one of the best campaigns I've ever run.
+ Skull & Shackles is fun, but the first chapter is quite vicious and the second so broad a sandbox you might forget the plot entirely.
+ c'mon, who doesn't like pirates? The naval combat rules mostly work. Rum is apparently highly lethal on Golarion, though, and the early part of the AP swings back and forth between railroad and sandbox. It's fun, but the DM needs to read the series a couple times before running it.

Tier 3 — Strong elements but need major re-writes
9. Council of Thieves. They tried to fix the problems of Curse of the Crimson Throne and failed miserably. The first part was largely forgettable as all of the NPCs you meet are then ignored for the rest of the AP. The back story is handed out in bits of pieces but never really comes together. Even after you killed the BBEG you are wondering who the guy was. The best element of this AP was Part 2. It actually comes with a script and the PCs can act out the murder play. For a theatrically inclined group it would be amazing, for a group of dice rollers, not so much.

10. Second Darkness. This one isn't as bad as it seems. Parts 1 and 2 are actually really good. Part 3 is fun but the elves come across as very unlikable. Parts 4 is unique and part 6 was fun with lots of tough boss fights. The big reason people love to hate this AP is part 5 which was a total disaster and needs a complete rewrite. One interesting fix for this AP I saw, is to drop parts 1 and 2 (which didn't really fit with the rest of the AP) and make the PCs Lantern Bearers.
+ I'd recommend Second Darkness, with a few modifications here and there. Overall, it's the one that required the least effort on my part, but I did skip the fifth adventure entirely because it seemed so illogical and the PCs probably would have just said «fuck it, we quit» if I had.
+ I like the overall concept, but it has some definite execution problems. I like the fifth part, where you get to deal with the elven Dai Li basically, but it's placed incorrectly. It should either be between part three and four, or it should be a much shorter diversion(say have the gate at the end of part four directly dump them into the tower under siege in such a way that the whole thing can be done with in a session). If I had one real complaint is that for as wild and weird and interesting as the Darklands are, especially Orm(even including the Drow part of it), the whole thing is remarkable safe focusing almost entirely on traditional Drow doing tradition Drow things, only the Land of Black Blood really shakes it up and even then it's mostly just a site for a bunch of wilderness encounters during the final adventure.

11. Jade Regent. Don't get me wrong I liked the Asian themes but this AP just didn't work for me. Chapters written by James Jacobs are generally great and Part 1s are generally great but I just didn't care for the first part of Jade Regent. The caravan rules are broken, I didn't love the NPCs (even though some are returning from earlier APs), and I didn't love the dungeon. Part 2 didn't really work for me either. I liked the travelling in Part 3. Its rare that the environment plays such a central role in the game. Part 4 started out strong but I didn't like the dungeon that it led to. I heard someone replaced it with the Jade Ruby Tournament which sounds like fun. I love the idea behind Part 5. Rally different factions into rebellion against the Jade Regent but I was not thrilled with its execution. It could easily be expanded and made more awesome.
+ It's a combination of fiddly subsystems, made to Paizo's usual standard for that sort of thing, and managing relationships with NPCs.
+ I really liked this one. Interesting characters, interesting locations, a lot of stuff happens, the plot is introduced early. But it does have some real issues. It's focused on Oni… which are mostly in the mid to high teens of CR, so they're mostly absent until the last two adventures. For a Asian themed AP, you don't actually reach the Asia expy until the last two adventures. The second and third adventures could use a lot of cleaning up, they're unnecessarily long and convoluted. The last adventure is essentially a loose campaign to itself because the primary meat of the AP(getting to the Japan expy and fighting for your friend's throne from Oni) is all in that one adventure, everything else has just been the travelogue of getting there.
+ Jade Regent is fun because there's a reason for the characters to keep moving (a caravan journey across the North Pole), and it's the Oriental Adventures campaign for Golarion. The caravan rules are a case of We Didn't Playtest This, and caravan combats are hideously broken from about the second half of book 3 onward.

12. Serpents Skull. Part One is one of the stronger adventures out there and darn near perfect. Part 2 is fun if you play up the different faction rivalries but Part 3 is a big mess like Part 5 of Second Darkness. There were so many things they could have done with Saventh-Yi and what we got was kill 60 Mobs to pacify this part of the city. Thanks. Part 4 was only OK except for the Gorilla King which I thought was a excellent encounter. Parts 5 and 6 mainly involved trips down into the Darklands to kill snakemen. Yawn. Now the end boss of this AP is great. He is a tough mofo and should challenge any party. The best part is that should the PCs be good enough to defeat him, an avatar of his god emerges and they have to fight that too. It is just as tough as the BBEG if not stronger. I've started this campaign twice but never made it to the end which is a shame since this would be an epic fight.
+ I really into the idea of Serpent's Skull, just because you just never otherwise go to Africa in RPGs.
+ is awesome, just beware the random TPK monster around level 5 or so (the one where you're forewarned by finding a magic item that casts a spell that wouldn't normally do anything to that monster, with no indication that it does something other, that just for the GM to know, and if you actually do randomly try this one-shot irrelevant expensive magic item, and you do manage to set up everything just right, there's still a greater than 50% chance of nothing happening). Other than that, it's great, until late part 4/early 5, where hordes of badly designed underleveled humanoids make you dread rolling for initiative, also, managing bullshit relationships.
+ This one has a bit of a opposite of the usual for the APs, instead of it steadily getting more fillery and poorly written as it goes, here the first two adventures can be essentially jettisoned as they're pretty much entirely filler. But the meat of the AP, the city and beyond, is really good and the finale is IMO one of the better of the APs.

Others (New):
Iron Gods
+ Im running Iron Gods, and I gotta say it's one of the best APs I've ever had the pleasure of being a part of. Of course it's not for everyone (you've got your lasers and robots in my dragons and magic!) but the campaign manages to invoke its sci-fi elements very well while staying firmly within a fantasy world.
+ Iron Gods is more interesting to me as a way to translate sci-fi to PF. The adventures seem fairly solid, although there's definitely more stuff for gunslingers than other combat characters. It's better than Council of Thieves, and fairly well written, but is probably the second least likely to be played by any group I sit at a table with.

Wrath of the Righteous
+ I'm currently playing my way through Wrath of the Righteous and am quite enjoying it. Its difficulty level is a mixed bag — we're playing it as veterans with a 20-point build, but we're not romping through it. Some encounters are trivial because certain foes have no defence against the things the party can pull off, but there are some great set-pieces where all hell breaks loose, massive effects go off, massive monsters go down and when the dust settles you look at your sheet and say "...and we're only level [x]". You do get a genuinely mythic feel, now and again. 

4 комментария

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Спасибо за пост.
Беда в оценке Paizo APs в том, что чтобы адекватно их оценивать их все надо пройти. КАК??? КАК ЭТО ВООБЩЕ ВОЗМОЖНО??? Их так много, они такие все вкусные, а времени так мало!
Хотя… Всегда ведь можно бросить работу…
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Можно ещё опросить по две три группы, игравшие в разные AP. Тоже трудоёмкая задача. Готов открыть патреон и играть/писать отзывы на АП ;)
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Ну, есть немало моментов, которые вполне можно оценить просто при чтении (например, что Крепость каменных великанов — отличное подземелье, а Грехи спасителей — не очень).
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Не то чтобы, но мне таки их довольно паровозно водили, и таки сам между делом читал и чуть менее паровозно водил. В основном в рамках первых двух книжек, правда.
Т1
Красный трон @ Не играл.
Короледел @ Имхопереоценен.
Рунлорды @ Не играл.
т2
Правление зимы @ В целом справедливо.
Расколотая звезда @ Не играл.
Тухлая корона @ В целом справедливо.
Наследие огня @ В целом справедливо.
Череп и оковы @ Не играл.
т3.
Собрание воров @ Не играл.
Вторая тьма @ Не играл.
Нефритовый наследник @ В целом справедливо.
Змеиный череп @ Не играл.
— Железные боги @ Вот его момент когда «campaign manages to invoke its sci-fi elements» делает мменя очень грустить, я если честно ожидал несколько другого.
Гнев праведного @ В целом справедливо.
— Маска мумии @ Не играл.
Гигигантоубийцы @ Не играл, но предполагаю, что будет на уровне правления зимы или наследия огня.
— А еще мне весьма понравились Дремлющий Царь и Раппан Атук, но они немного не АП и не официальные.
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